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Thursday, August 02, 2007
I just attended the seminar...and bought into the $99.00 kit....then last night I attended the seminar section with Mike Symes...I kept feeling that making money this way was really being part of the problem with our world...but I must admit it sounds like it really works...but well...it is SUPPOSED TO sound like it really will work isn't it...? I am hoping I am not in trouble having bought the $99.00 website kit...any input here?...thanks for your time....
Clickincome is dedicated to providing excellent customer service and continues to improve its services and systems. We work to satisfy all concerns, whether you are a client or not.
We remain faithful to our clients, fixing problems and overcoming misunderstandings. Clickincome prides itself on it continual growth and a focus on providing the best possible educational experience for your investment. We will deal with each complaint on a case-by-case basis and consistently strive for excellence in resolutions. Those who complain are always heard and we greet them and service their complaint the same as we greet our thousands of satisfied, successful clients.
We urge you to contact Clickincome directly at 1-800-576-9441 or email us at [email protected] immediately to identify and attend to your concerns. We are here to help.
America enjoys freedom of speech and we here at Clickincome honor our American heritage and welcome any and all comments and feedback. Remember, even our competitors and disgruntled employees can post negative blogs. Many negative blogs and forums are meant to drive traffic to their own site and are posted by individuals who have never been involved with the Clickincome program in any way. Websites that boast negative reviews of products or services are generally trying to sell you something they produced or relabeled. This is a common occurrence in any rapidly growing niche industry.
Clickincome and parent company are enjoying over 14 years in business and have thousands of successful clients and students. One can expect any company in business this long servicing the public to have complaints; it is how the company handles those complaints that sets them apart. Our wish is that all questions or concerns had come to us first so we could have expedited the matter and satisfied the parties involved.
Clickincome
I appreciate that and I believe it now.Quote:
Originally Posted by ClickIncome
Wait, you're not going to come 100% clean if you can't back up your claims -- where are the "thousands of successful clients"?Quote:
Originally Posted by ClickIncome
I don't see them at http://clickincome.com/clickincome_testimonials.php
There are 6 testimonials there and only 1 link to a successful clients website.
If you expect us to believe that it's "thousands of successful clients" then you better back it up.
I think you can believe them on this -- please contact them first before sharing your story here or elsewhere.Quote:
Originally Posted by ClickIncome
They're trying to downplay the informative posts from former customers and employees about them.Quote:
Originally Posted by ClickIncome
Again, Clickincome is trying to divert your attention. My posts are not meant to drive traffic to my own websites but is meant to help people that have serious concerns that were not being resolved in a timely manner as well as to warn the public until Clickincome gets its past cleaned up 100%.Quote:
Originally Posted by ClickIncome
This part is true -- some, not all -- some websites offer reviews of Clickincome and a whole bunch of other money marketing opportunities in order to sell you their service. Those websites are not true consumer advocacy websites but instead are just trying to sell you their stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by ClickIncome
How long has Clickincome been in the business of selling the web education / business opportunity packages? What year did Clickincome get started doing what they're currently doing?Quote:
Originally Posted by ClickIncome
And again, show us the "thousands of successful clients" of Clickincome. Show us their websites. I will edit this post if I'm incorrect. I'm just going based on what is publicly available.
Of course that's true but it is the number of complaints compared to number of past and current customers that gives you the big picture. It's also important to ask these questions:Quote:
Originally Posted by ClickIncome
* What percentage of new customers come from referrals from current or former customers?
* What percentage of students make back their initial investment within 6 months or within 12 months?
Yes, I believe that. But you can't cover up the sins and mistakes of your previous sales guys and other bad apples. You have to come fully clean and take responsibility for what they did. As their employer you have to apologize for their sins/mistakes.Quote:
Originally Posted by ClickIncome
Any private investigator can look up your credit report or mine and read it. Why should not the public know about your recent past?
With a company that does business with the public, they should be willing to have their record be open -- both the problems and the resolutions should be open for the public to see.
Then after a clean track record of a few years or whatever is fair -- then i agree that the complaints should be taken down. I honestly believe in forgiving and forgetting after enough time has passed. I would like to do that with Clickincome but their refusal to take 100% responsibility for their actions is what is holding them back. Of course they can't completely control all their employees but as a corporation they have to apologize for whatever any of their employees do -- personally i think they should make their ex-sales guys get on here and apologize or at least apologize privately to those customers they have offended.
As the public can see my intentions are honorable. Let the public be the judges according to their own consciences.
Roger L. Brown
Provo, Utah
former employee of Clickincome, Inc. from March 2004 -> August 2005
Reading all of these replies , especially Roger Browns, has lead me to 2 conclusions. Clickincome has alot of enemies, and may have bad karma coming back at them, but seems to be not hiding which doesnt completely make them evil maybe incompetent or overwhelmed or dealing with people with unrealistic expectations when starting a business. #2) Roger Brown i believed you at first but there comes a point when someone babbles on for so long with no point with no substance and such a High opinion of themself, that I started to defend that company in my mind and wonder who the real loser is. if this is how you spend your time, and with what motive i dont know, i question your credibility. You undeniably think higher of yourself than you ought. I've never heard of a "former" employee" with so much to say and express and who was happy anyways. i will never do business with clickincome or support the cause you are promoting, whether it be your religion or yourself, who knows? theres just so much babble. Do yourself a favor and get out in your community and spend your energy helping the poor, homeless people of America. Thats what a winner would do. anyone can type, it burns no calories, do something in life that takes real effort, then let somneone else pat you on the back not yourself. Sorry if this sounds personal but your last post of God-like arrogance really turned me off to you.
August 17th, 2007:
Do you believe that the complaints are only the result of people with unrealistic expectations?Quote:
Originally Posted by thetruth
I agree that some that I experienced while an employee were partially the result of unrealistic expectations -- expectations that had been built up by their sales guys && then also by the customers' own imaginations.
Did you also believe that there was false statements made to some of the customers?
Is that not what you said previously?
You fought pretty vigorously against them less than 4 months ago:
April 30, 2007:
Quote:
Originally Posted by thetruth
Now back to yesterday, August 17th:
I'm not sure why you misunderstand me now. You say that I've babbled on with no point and no substance. Where exactly do you believe that I have had no point and no substance?Quote:
Originally Posted by thetruth
Your post above seems to be guilty of what you are accusing me of. You give no proof of your accusations.
I feel like I'm fighting for what's right without being arrogant. Please don't twist my boldness into arrogance in your mind.
The points that have been made are of substance -- go back and read them.
You've cast aspersions on my motives -- you are speculating with no substance to your doubts.
You have not given me the benefit of the doubt and it's ironic that you do not know of the community service that I give every month.
I'm also the chairman of a local grassroots city watchdog group.
One of our very biggest issues is fighting some elites in city government over their attitude and laws that hurt the poor when it comes to affordable housing for all. The suffering that city officials and vocal special interest groups have caused is really sad.
It's extremely ironic what you've accused me of. Next time please ask and give me the benefit of the doubt before speculating.
It is a fair question to ask what are my motives in posting here -- i.e. why am I here doing this?
#1 - to clear my own conscience since in a relatively few instances i exaggerated with the students that I taught. I exaggerated my own marketing skills in getting one of my websites up to 50,000+ pageviews a month. The number was true but it was not due to big marketing prowess that it got to be that way. I also feel bad that i stayed with a company that i did not believe in anymore and that i mostly hid how i felt from my students. it's not fair to stay with a company that you don't believe in. But i'm human and i was desperate for work and to pay my bills and so i stayed longer than i should have. my students have been gracious and kind and understanding in forgiving me. You can ask them -- they feel that i was the most honest person that they dealt with there.
#2 - to help students that feel that they were outright lied to or exaggerated to. there are business opportunity laws in Utah that legally they can file a complaint with. I also spend a little bit of my time in posting on discussions about other companies in Utah. Companies for which I have no connection. I want to let people know about the Utah Division of Consumer Protection. Utah has a black eye as the result of unscrupulous schemes and questionable seminar sales practices and I would like more people outside of Utah to not have a knee jerk reaction due to the bad apples here. I'm not some whiner that complains without offering hope. I do not criticize without offering suggestions for improvement. Even Troy Stevens at Clickincome can back me up on that one. I still suggest that they give the mentoring lessons to each of their sales guys so that they understand better what they're selling.
#3 - to help prevent it from happening again -- remember my experiences are 2 years ago but yet we still have people currently complaining about similar problems in the present.
#4 - in my last post I spoke favorably of my impression of Clickincome trying to fix things quicker than they did while i was there 2 years ago. Please re-read what i wrote. i believe that they're moving in the right direction. I hope that they see it through to the very end -- until everything is resolved completely. Because things don't go away on their own.
Please believe me when I say that I believe in what I'm fighting for though I'm not perfect. If I can be shown where I have mistakenly supported a cause then I am not afraid to change my mind. I am not afraid to change my mind when I can be shown part of the bigger picture that I had missed.
I'm trying to be both bold and humble and as people can see I'm not perfect at it.
Don't shoot down the valid points just because the speaker is imperfect. My heart is trying to help.
And I believe that they are moving towards the right direction now.
Sincerely,Quote:
Originally Posted by Clickincome
Roger L. Brown
Provo, UT
Has anyone gotten their money back who requested it back within the 3 day cancellation period? Anymore tips you can give that can be added onto the excellent tips that dreamweaver gave? Thanks, Anonymous
I have saved all of my correspondance with Click Income over the last two years. I tried repeatedly to cancell with them... and they've been trying to give me "the slip" for too long. Tired of being ignored and phone calls not returned. Is anyone EVER "in" when you call?!! I've long since closed my accounts but wonder if they actually follow up on the credit threat letters they send. Not wanting to find out, I am interested in participating in a lawsuit. Can someone please contact me?
I just wanted to add my two cents about my recent experience at a Clickincome Seminar.
I, too, was taken in by their offer and went as far as to purchase the $99.00 pkg along with the SEM software that was offered to me for an additional $20.00 for a total purchase of $119.00.
The nice man conducting the sale seemed frantic to have me sign the contract in front of me.
I gave my credit card information to him and on the contract was a box that said "Credit card imprint". However, instead of imprinting the card (simply done by rubbing a sharpee over the card) he copied the card number onto the paper along with the 3 digit security number from the back of the card.
I was told that I had until Monday, (8-27-07) to cancel the contract so I went ahead with it.
I attended the "training" presentation 2 days later and was given the hard sell to spend $3,995.00 on their package offer to help me set up my internet business. I did not agree to this, however, I had a friend attend with me, at Clickincome's suggestion, and together we determined what the scam was.
Later that evening, she called me and advised me to read some of the postings on this web site. We also went to the Clickincome site where I would be allowed to build my own web site. We found a program to build a web site and not a whole lot more. We only accessed the site, we didn't attempt to play with the software or build a site.
I came to the conclusion that I needed to cancel whatever agreement I had made with them within the 3 day grace period and spent $30.00 on postage to make sure my decision reached their address by the 3rd day.
I also went to my bank and showed them the copy of the contract I was given and the information that was written on it regarding my credit card.
My bank informed me that merchants NEVER write down the 3 digit security number on the back of the card. Furthermore, they said that with the information they had about me they could charge anything they wanted to my account without my knowledge.
Now, so far as I can tell, they aren't shopping on anyone else's tab, they just continue to debit charges that they consider to be legitimate for their own services.
I thoroughly read the contract and refund policy and determined that they were offering me a "refund" ie, they would charge my card for the amount authorized. I was required to cancel both the use of their software and the agreement for the montly charge for hosting the web page separately. They would then send me an address via 1st class mail instructing me where to return the items I had in my possession. If the items were deemed to be in unsatisfactory condtion, they would refund my money, less $35.00 for the materials and allowed themselves up to 30 days after receiving them to refund my money.
The contract also stated that if they weren't able to collect money due them from my account that they would send a paper bill.
Feeling pretty studpid at this point for buying into what is one of the oldest cons in the book (Bait & Switch) I decided to put the ball in their court. I followed the instructions for cancellation but I also changed my bank card at the bank rendering the information they had about me useless for collecting money from me.
I also sent them a letter informing them that they could send me a paper bill for the amount owed on the materials I received, up to $55.00, which is the value of what I actually received from them. So, rather than mess around with any more of my time or money, I thought it best to let them attempt to collect what I "owe".
I hate to admit that yes, greed on my part did get the best of my better judgement but I did not like the tone of the comments about this company that are featured on this web forum. Also, I believe in making money honestly.
I am willing to pay for the materials I have in my possession with a money order. I do believe they are operating just within the law or they would have disappeared a long time ago. Three+ years is a long time to continue any con. Whether or not they are breaking any laws, I doubt and would not be interested in participating in any lawsuit.
I do feel foolish because I have enough experience in sales to know that there were many red flags that popped up during the course of the initial seminar. I chose to ignore them.
And, while I would like to create and maintain a web site at some time in the future, I am going to acheive that goal a little more carefully and for a lot less money than what Clickinvoice is offering.
Oh, and just so you know, I read the "positive" feedback messages, too and they have a familiar seminar sound to them which fails to convince me of anything. I feel like I just barely got out from under this before it became a very expensive problem, something I have no shortage of and no desire to add to. I'm just glad I have a friend who spends a little more time on the internet than I do who helped steer me out of this mess in time.
Good Luck!:
Clickincome is dedicated to providing excellent customer service and continues to improve its services and systems. We work to satisfy all concerns, whether you are a client or not.
We remain faithful to our clients, fixing problems and overcoming misunderstandings. We, Clickincome, pride ourselves in our continual growth and in our focus on providing the best possible educational experience for your investment. We will deal with each complaint on a case-by-case basis and consistently strive for excellence in resolutions. Those with complaints are always heard and we greet them and service their situation the same as we greet our thousands of satisfied, successful clients.
We urge you to contact Clickincome directly at 1-800-576-9441 or email us at [email protected] immediately to identify and attend to your concerns. We are here to help.
America enjoys freedom of speech and we here at Clickincome honor our American heritage and welcome any and all comments and feedback. Many negative blogs and forums are meant to drive traffic to their own site and are posted by individuals who have never been involved with the Clickincome program in any way. Websites that boast negative reviews of products or services are generally trying to sell you something they produced or relabeled. This is a common occurrence in any rapidly growing niche industry.
Clickincome and parent company are enjoying over 14 years in business and have thousands of successful clients and students. One can expect any company in business this long servicing the public to have complaints; it is how the company handles those complaints that set them apart. Our wish is that all questions or concerns had come to us first so we could have expedited the matter and satisfied the parties involved.
Let us help you,
Clickincome
here's a recent ad for their seminars today the 5th and tomorrow the 6th in Agoura Hills, and Ventura, California:
http://display.venturacountystar.com...x?advid=429629
Wed. September 5th @ 3pm and 7pm
Renaissance Agoura Hills Hotel
30100 Agoura Rd
Agoura Hills, CA
Thursday, September 6th @ 9am, 1pm and 7pm
Crowne Plaza Hotel/Ventura beach
450 E. Harbor Blvd
Ventura, CA
It mentions that you can register at http://auctionsuccesspro.com if you want to get first-hand knowledge of what they're selling and how they're doing it.
P.S. (Edited 9/15 to add this updated link.)
The newspaper link above no longer shows the ad.
But you can still see Google's copy at:
http://www.google.com/search?q=cache...3Fadvid=429629
I'm so glad I overheard a lady in the bathroom, between one of the breaks, mentioning how she had found some negative things on the internet about clickincome....
I was at their seminar today, my city is Jacksonville, FL. Thank God I did not purchase the program, except the $99 membership and $20 for the magic search disk.
After reading everything, I'm going try to cancel everything and get a refund, though I did the first part of the seminar on Thursday, I hope FL does not consider Saturday a business day. I'm afraid of being charged for the webhosting even though I didn't even get the website up yet. If anyone has any advice, please let me know. I will also keep everyone posted on what happens. I'm feel so sorry for those people that actually purchased the whole program. I'm glad I decided to check them out!
I have good news - I followed all the instructions for getting a refund and I got my refund back from Clickincome. In my last post I asked if anyone had any experience with getting a refund back under the 3 day refund policy and I am happy to say that ClickIncome proved its reliability to me in giving me a full refund. THANK YOU CLICKINCOME !!! Cheers, Anonymous
Although from the posts of clickincome one gets the impression that it indeed is a great program but then again there are guys who do not think so....!!
@ mlister
hi can u please tell me the reason u r seeking refund .....??
It looks like Clickincome is holding both free and paid seminars
in Mesquite, Texas and Dallas, Texas
this Thursday and Friday, November 8th and 9th, 2007:
Thursday, November 8th @ 9am & 1pm
Hampton Inn & Suites
1700 Rodeo Drive
Mesquite, TX 75149
(972)329-3100
Thursday, November 8th @ 7pm
Renaissance Dallas Hotel
2222 Stemmons Freeway
Dallas, TX 75207
(214)631-2222
Friday, November 9th @ 9am & 1pm
Renaissance Dallas Hotel
(same as above)
http://shopping.dallasnews.com/ROP/a...86237&cat=3983
Michael Symes, whom the ad says is an Ebay expert, is going to be speaking.
That would be cool to see his monthly net income from Ebay listings on a month by month basis over the years he's been doing it. I wonder if his monthly net income changes according to the season. I hear that more sales are made on Ebay in the winter and less in the summer since more people are outdoors. Anyway, it would be interesting to hear the Ebay info that Michael Symes and Clickincome gives out at their seminars and to see how much it's worth. Then compare it to other Ebay and ecommerce mentors' info and prices.
If you're curious and live anywhere close to Dallas, it would be probably be worth it to go.
Let us know what you find out.
Roger Brown
It would be very entertaining to drop into this site thread from time to time just to read Clickincome's shills if it wasn't for the fact that these people are the lowest scum on the business totem pole and still out there victimizing good, decent, honest, trusting people. Actually, it's not a business in the classic sense of that word as most reasonable people understand the term. It's just another scam. This is a sting operation, one of the ugliest I've seen. They prey on unsophisticated people looking for a way to make some extra money or to get an internet business going. Some victims are housewives, the disabled, retirees, people already down on their luck, and some are very young people with a lot of ambi+ion and little experience in the business world looking for earnings to pay for a college education.
Just so you clickincome folks understand, I'm recently retired from thirty-four years as a criminal investigator for consumer fraud and bunco.