or_Josh...thanks for the info. How are you affiliated with these guys?
I'll take a look at them. Have any of you guys heard of, demoed or use these guys? If so what was the experience?
Thanks
or_Josh...thanks for the info. How are you affiliated with these guys?
I'll take a look at them. Have any of you guys heard of, demoed or use these guys? If so what was the experience?
Thanks
Is anyone using Business Flow from MainStreet Commerce? http://mainstreetcommerce.com/
I would like some feedback regarding implementation and connecting their Website/OrderEntry system to other accounting systems. Also how they like the overall use of the program. Thank you.
BC
mutahman -
You've put an impressive amount of work into your search. I'm sure the info you've posted will be useful for a lot of merchants. There are just a couple of points that I would like to make:
First of all, there appear to be very different skill sets involved in creating shopping carts, order management systems and accounting software. There are few, if any, example of software companies that get all three right. So by restricting your search to totally integrated systems, you are probably ruling out some of the best examples of each in order to find one system that does at least a fair job of all three. Also, once you select an integrated system, if you decide you want to replace any one component (either because you are no longer satisfied with it or because a better alternative is becomes available), it may not be possible or practical to make that change.
Second, in response to your comments about having the CEO of a company reply to your information request. As you obviously know, you are not just choosing software; you are also choosing the company that produces, markets and supports it. It's like "Goldilocks": You don't want a company that is so big that your business is insignificant to them. Or one that is so small that they might not have the resources to survive and continue supporting their products. (Then there's open-source software, but that's a whole different animal.)
But size does not necessarily mean stability. Take NetSuite, for example. "In 2006, its revenue was $67 million and net loss was $35.7 million. For the nine months ended September 30, 2007, its revenue was $76.8 million and net loss was $20.6 million." Yes, they've gone public now, and have lots of money to work with, but do you really want to hitch your future to a company that's losing millions of dollars per year? What if they can't turn it around? Or what if they decide that your business is not profitable enough for them to bother with?
Then there's that small company CEO who's taking your sales call. That may be a sign of a company that is too small or too new to make you feel safe using them, or of a small but growing company with a CEO who still is actively involved in the day-to-day operations of his company and not afraid to talk directly to prospects and customers. (That sounds familiar, actually.<grin>) A better indicator of a company's stability might be the number of clients using their systems, and the ratio of employees to customers. Take a look at Ernie Schell's latest chart of order management companies at:
http://multichannelmerchant.com/opsa...s_solutions_2/
There are some familiar names there that only have a handfull of customers, and others that have a ridiculous number of employees per customer. To my mind, either of those conditions should make you think twice about risking your business on their products.
I hope you find some of those comments useful.
Barney
I certainly do find your comments informative. I agree with much of what you say, although much of this topic (or the points you bring up) are not zero sum.
My own hesitations around integrating multiple solutions and preferring to go "all in one" certainly cut down the number of options I have, yet (for me personally) I would rather deal with one vendor VS. multiple vendors and integrators.
I believe for my requirements (at least over the next 2-3 years) for CRM, erp, acctg and e-commerce are handled quite well with the “all in one” solutions on the market. Is any one of them perfect…NO. Will a “mix and match” of different softwares provide me with the perfect solution…MAYBE. And it will most likely be quite expensive for the integration and customization of bringing an integrator in to make everything “real time, all the time”.
3 years ago when trying to find an "all in one solution" I had very limited options, both in terms of the number of vendors who supplied an all in one solution AND the features offered in the few all in one solutions available. But today my options have grown considerably (number of vendors and the advancements in their software). Are all these options "ready for prime-time"....unfortunately not.....but we still have more choices today and if these guys can stay alive for another 12-18 months it will be interesting to see how many choices of kick-ass all in one software there will be on the market.
As a small business owner I couldn't agree with you more about how important it is to have the owner accessible to every customer (and quite frankly, many of the medium and larger companies should have the owner more accessible to customers). In this particular instance I like dealing directly with the owner, but it also leaves me a bit weary to have Mike doing the demo's..all the time. With him doing the demo’s who is running the company? Who is handling the support? Who is managing the engineering? These issues, regardless of size, are all important to me with regards to how my vendor operates. My point is, he cannot be doing demo's all day long and getting much else done. It's a perception issue, and quite frankly, it's his job to give me (us) the perception that he's NOT a one man band.
It is not my intent to disparage anyone person or company, and I want to see all these small guys make a legitimate run at the likes of Netsuite (and the other "big boys")...but in order for these little guys (Main Street, Comtech, Interprise, etc) to last in this survival of the fittest landscape they will have to continue to make strides on the features, functionality and support they have and also work on how we PERCEIVE them to be behind the scenes (because let’s face it, none of us have done a vendor visit to see what is really going on at their site(s).
With regards to Netsuite, of course no company is immune to going under, and I sincerely believe if they do not address their pricing OR their lack of open source they are going to have a major problem fending off these competitors and turning around the red ink. But much to your point here, at least with NS we know their financial position and the fact that they have the money (from the IPO) and the backing (from Larry) to feed the beast for a while…we don’t know if any of these other guys may be in the same red ink scene, and if so how would they finance a turn-around (or even just buy more time).
I like your post because it makes many of us think past just the issue of “ABC software has this feature and XYZ doesn’t”.
I’m going to probably regret posting this next line (expecting to get inundated with PM’s) but if any integrators feel they can put together a kick ass, real time ERP, CRM, ACCTG and e-commerce build for us that would be $20-25K (including the integration and implementation) then PM me with what you have in mind and I’ll certainly take a look
Hope this all helps
I have been looking at a system from rla-assist.com called Esyst. Has anyone looked at this? Any comments? I am in the same position as you mutahman, waiting for the ideal package to roll out.
Would appreciate any comments.
I am in the same boat as well...I like Barney's posts. I will look at the link that you posted for order managment systems.
Is anyone using an order managment system with a built in website that they are happy with? We would need it to connect to Microsoft Small Business Financials (Great Plains Lite). Has anyone tried AdvanceWare? Ideally it should cost between 5K-15K with implementation. Thanks.
www.netsuite.com
We've used NetSuite since 2001. It is very powerful software, and has been from the beginning. When it comes time for renewal, though, be ready for the hassle of the year. They must have training courses in irritation and negotiation. My recommendation to anyone signing up would be to request a written contract that no features would be de-bundled, and some kind of cost lock for a period of time. Anything you can do to avoid their renewal sales staff, the better. I think that most businesses that use the product, after determining the right package for their operation, will like it. Their support is not as good as it used to be. It seems to be fairly rare that we've needed it, though.www.netbooks.com
I think their achille's heel was their choice to focus on mid-market in ~2002. Identity crisis and hunger for faster profits. I don't think it served them well, and they lost a lot of customers (probably at renewal time). Packages and terminology changed every so often.
It is sure fascinating to see some of the upstarts that seek to eat NetSuite's lunch. Below...
These people seem to have a very solid base. Their software thinks differently than the others I've tried, and I think it may be totally worth it to get your mind around it. I bet they will hit their stride during 2008 and be a big contender. I like that they have so much focus on true small businesses. The manufacturing (production), inventory and other features we tried were well done. As of this writing, I think they have a couple of broad strokes to add yet, but they say it won't be long. I was not a big fan of the e-commerce software they chose to connect to: CRE Loaded. I prefer www.avactis.com, head and shoulders above as it is far more intuitive.www.sql-ledger.org
Impressive for open source. Host it on your own Linux or XP/2000 box for LAN or WAN. Very affordable. It would leave any buyer enough budget to bring in a specialist to make it their own. I'm keeping my eye close on this one.www.cougarmtn.com
Their Pro package consists of a server that they install onsite. It is preconfigured and accessible over WAN and LAN. Sounds very cool. However, their salesperson never delivered the quote. It sounded to be between $7k - $10k.www.interprisesuite.com
As discussed on this thread already. One to watch, I'm sure. I bet they'll do a pretty good job with some refinement.www.mainstreetcommerce.com
No impressions either way, yet.www.saasu.com (www.netaccounts.com)
I liked their trial. It is internationally oriented, and in time, I think they'll have a good system.www.bizautomation.com
Another new one. Looks like it would be worth a try.www.intaact.com
If you call for a quote, expect to be interrogated for an hour. Then make sure you're sitting down when they quote you. $10k for the license, and another $20k for integration, setup, fees, destination charge, etc. They claim to be a competitor to NetSuite, but I don't see that. Their website is very attractive, yet cryptic and unsubstantial. I suspect they are trying to hide the price and lack of features.www.efinancials.com
Very new. Still in beta. Looks like they have the model right.www.epeachtree.com
Ho, hum. Moving along.
www.nolapro.com
Very intruiging. I'm watching them closely, too.
www.objacct.com
This almost seems like a kit for developers. Looks loaded. No idea on price.www.intuit.com
Intuit's Quickbooks Enterprise looks quite powerful, but it networks over the WAN with thin-client technology, which is frankly cheesy. $3k-$6k.www.microsoft.com/dynamics
I only took the presentation tour, which was expectedly professional. I kind of got turned off when I heard of all the integration with MS Office. Great. Buy more expensive Office licenses for multiple users. We were successfully weaned from that to OpenOffice. Can't go back. But, hey. Anyone want to look into it further?www.plexus.com
Manufacturing oriented. No experience with it yet.www.distone.com
I couldn't get past their web design. Look away. It's hideous. Maybe I'm a little touchy, but spend several days researching accounting software, and you'll start disqualifying them for anything.www.ronpaul2008.com
Best site on economics, markets and policy I've seen yet. Don't know how well they'll do. This one depends on the electorate.I wish all researchers grand success in their businesses. I think I'd rather get a tooth pulled than go through another bout of researching accounting software. I hope this post will help someone speed through their own search.
www.netsuite.com
We've used NetSuite since 2001. It is very powerful software, and has been from the beginning. When it comes time for renewal, though, be ready for the hassle of the year. They must have training courses in irritation and negotiation. My recommendation to anyone signing up would be to request a written contract that no features would be de-bundled, and some kind of cost lock for a period of time. Anything you can do to avoid their renewal sales staff, the better. I think that most businesses that use the product, after determining the right package for their operation, will like it. Their support is not as good as it used to be. It seems to be fairly rare that we've needed it, though.
I think their achille's heel was their choice to focus on mid-market in ~2002. Identity crisis and hunger for faster profits. I don't think it served them well, and they lost a lot of customers (probably at renewal time). Packages and terminology changed every so often.
It is sure fascinating to see some of the upstarts that seek to eat NetSuite's lunch. Below...
www.netbooks.com
These people seem to have a very solid base. Their software thinks differently than the others I've tried, and I think it may be totally worth it to get your mind around it. I bet they will hit their stride during 2008 and be a big contender. I like that they have so much focus on true small businesses. The manufacturing (production), inventory and other features we tried were well done. As of this writing, I think they have a couple of broad strokes to add yet, but they say it won't be long. I was not a big fan of the e-commerce software they chose to connect to: CRE Loaded. I prefer www.avactis.com, head and shoulders above as it is far more intuitive.
www.sql-ledger.org
Impressive for open source. Host it on your own Linux or XP/2000 box for LAN or WAN. Very affordable. It would leave any buyer enough budget to bring in a specialist to make it their own. I'm keeping my eye close on this one.
www.cougarmtn.com
Their Pro package consists of a server that they install onsite. It is preconfigured and accessible over WAN and LAN. Sounds very cool. However, their salesperson never delivered the quote. It sounded to be between $7k - $10k.
www.interprisesuite.com
As discussed on this thread already. One to watch, I'm sure. I bet they'll do a pretty good job with some refinement.
www.mainstreetcommerce.com
No impressions either way, yet.
www.saasu.com (www.netaccounts.com)
I liked their trial. It is internationally oriented, and in time, I think they'll have a good system.
www.bizautomation.com
Another new one. Looks like it would be worth a try.
www.intaact.com
If you call for a quote, expect to be interrogated for an hour. Then make sure you're sitting down when they quote you. $10k for the license, and another $20k for integration, setup, fees, destination charge, etc. They claim to be a competitor to NetSuite, but I don't see that. Their website is very attractive, yet cryptic and unsubstantial. I suspect they are trying to hide the price and lack of features.
www.efinancials.com
Very new. Still in beta. Looks like they have the model right.
www.epeachtree.com
Ho, hum. Moving along.
www.nolapro.com
Very intruiging. I'm watching them closely, too.
www.objacct.com
This almost seems like a kit for developers. Looks loaded. No idea on price.
www.intuit.com
Intuit's Quickbooks Enterprise looks quite powerful, but it networks over the WAN with thin-client technology, which is frankly cheesy. $3k-$6k.
www.microsoft.com/dynamics
I only took the presentation tour, which was expectedly professional. I kind of got turned off when I heard of all the integration with MS Office. Great. Buy more expensive Office licenses for multiple users. We were successfully weaned from that to OpenOffice. Can't go back. But, hey. Anyone want to look into it further?
www.plexus.com
Manufacturing oriented. No experience with it yet.
www.distone.com
I couldn't get past their web design. Look away. It's hideous. Maybe I'm a little touchy, but spend several days researching accounting software, and you'll start disqualifying them for anything.
www.ronpaul2008.com
Best site on economics, markets and policy I've seen yet. Don't know how well they'll do. This one depends on the electorate.
I wish all researchers grand success in their businesses. I think I'd rather get a tooth pulled than go through another bout of researching accounting software. I hope this post will help someone speed through their own search.
Mainstreet is a FL based small company that seems to have an ecommerce platform that seems to look ideal for online retailers. It is competitively priced that looks barely affordable enough for an SMB to buy it.
IT is written in .net and uses MS SQL Database. They seem to have a robust backoffice that can be wired to have a website that can have a custom look and feel.
So far so good, right? Well, that is the mousetrap. The company does not understand that software is only as good as the company's service level, which is non-existent. They have no appreciation for their customers or care if they stay or leave. Since they get paid for their license fee upfront, they have no interest in keeping you as a customer anyway. The CEO who runs the company has no ethics, very difficult to talk to. Their deployment of the software is what it comes down to. Their resources are limited and therefore they make their customers wait forever. They always want to get paid upfront for their "professional services", which is for deployment but anytime you express your dissatisfaction, they are ready to suspend your work.
Bottom line, this company needs to educate itself and clean up its act to appreciate their customers. They need a professional CEO who understands software = service and put in place a proper project management process.
Otherwise, they will go down in flames and hurt many companies in the first place.
My recommendation is to make a solid date specific product deployment plan that is associated with payment, which includes their license fee. Once you pay that you are stuck anyway. And tie in penalties if they delay. They will agree to anything until you make payment, after which they won't even hear you.
They need a good lesson and a shake up to realize their true potential.
I will be happy to provide further info if anyone needs it.
MainStreet Commerce
MainStreet Commerce has recently announced that BusinessFlow is available for $950 a month - with no up front license fee, no per user fees, and you get all of the software. You can also cancel if you have an issue. Services are optional and you can have your own developer work the project.
Customers say that customer service/tech support is rapidly improving.
There are absolutely legitimate concerns and a heavy dose of truth in the delays as professional services has been very busy. When someone wants MainStreet to do project work for the company, they have had to wait for a slotting which has been sometimes 4 or 5 weeks out. Acknowledging is hopefully a strong indication that there is a sincere desire to improve.
During the past few months, the company has been working hard to correct and improve this and make more resources and documentation available. This has involved implementing a support portal, providing 2 hour "hot topic" conference call sessions, and beefing up support for third party developers who can do implementations of BusinessFlow.
There most definitely is an appreciation for customers. Hopefully, the blend of strong software along with improved project management process, and just generally trying to reach out in every way to provide assistance will benefit everyone.
According to this posting, they start a project in 4 or 5 weeks as "Professional Services" is busy. How about 4 or 5 months after several lies? By the way, when they do start a project, they don't finish it either. They simply say "we are done, we now want to hand it off to your developer". If we have our own developer, why do we need their "Professional Services". Of course, since they charge by the hour, if you ever find thngs they did wrong, they don't want to touch it or they simply want more money to do more work. They have no accountability what-so-ever.Quote:
Originally Posted by CSR
Stay away from this company at all costs.
We regret ever having to go with them. They are not worth the cheap price ticket. They end up costing you so much business in the long run.
Here is another company worth looking at....compiere (www.compiere.com)
They say they are "open source" and yes, you do get the source code when you buy the product. But it's not "open source" in the most true sense whereby the developer community influences the feature enhancements and upgrades built into the product. All the built in feature enhancements and upgrades are built in by the company. Another thing to note, while the truest of the true "open source" solutions are free, these guys (while they do offer a free version of their software) are really moving toward a proprietary model. You can download a free version of the software, but it doesn't have as many out of the box features as their "professional" paid version. The paid version is probably the best software I have seen go against Netsuite (at least for our needs). It has solid CRM and accounting functionality, the out of the box reports, drill down and dashboard are all solid and of course (because you have the source code and they have what they call an application dictionary) you can do any customization you want.
These guys are also much more cost effective then Netsuite. The minimum number of user licenses you can buy (if you go the paid route) is 10, and the cost is $7550 per year. It's a web based solution, and it's a yearly subscription fee. You can either host it on your own servers OR have it hosted. You will incur implementation costs (without servers it can run anywhere from $7K up, depending on how much tailoring, customization and data moving you have to do).
One thing you definitely need is an integrator you feel comfortable with. We had a meeting this morning with an integrator that just didn't give us the feeling they were all that knowledgeable...so while we do like the software, we are going to now look to find another integrator to work with. We do have these guys on the shortlist.
Hi,
I ended up developing my own all-in-one suite to run my own company, if anyone is interested in taking a look. It's like NetSuite. Chances are you guys will delete this post as self-promotion, but I don't really care. I just figured people might be interested in hearing about another option, especially from a member on the board. I'm not saying you have to buy it. Even some criticism would be nice, so I know how to make it better.
Aaron
Not at all Aaron. I didn't delete your post because I thought it was helpful.:)Quote:
Originally Posted by thinkcomp
Aaron, with all due respect, I believe your statement "It's like NetSuite" is a bit broad and misleading. It seems to me your product is a Saas accounting software, but does not offer CRM or SFA. If I'm wrong please let me know.
Roban it seems this thread has branched off to cover many different solutions...it seems it started as a "I'm a small business solution looking for an all in one ERP system" and now has posts in here that "compare" software(s) that are not really/exactly in the same space. In this thread we are now seeing "accounting" software being compared to full on ERP/CRM/ACCT/Ecomm software.
I just think it may be easier for new users to find info on the type(s) of solution they are looking for IF this thread was split up.
Just a thought
Hello mutahman,
Without going into too much detail, I would like to point out that my statement about Exponent being like NetSuite was not intended to be misleading, nor was it misleading in actuality. It does, in fact, contain several features that are directly related to customer relationship management, sales force automation, and e-commerce that you might not be aware of. Furthermore, your insinuation that people should not be comparing systems in different spaces seems unusual in light of your previous post about an open-source downloadable program, Compiere, which seems to be, in my opinion, quite a bit different than the predominantly closed-source web-based systems being discussed here.
I do agree that this is a very long thread, but especially given that my post was approved by the administrator just like everyone else's, I don't think that my mentioning one more alternative out of many, many others really hurt anyone.
Aaron
I like that people will present this kind of stuff here. I had no idea that Exponent was out there. I thought I was a good searcher on the web, but never came across it.
I think the market is ripe for this kind of application. There are so many accounting packages that miss the mark and disappoint in too many ways. I think the NetSuite model is pretty good, once you remove the hose-your-customers-at-renewal mentality, anyway.
EJ
Aaron, I was not trying to fire a shot across your bow. As per one of my previous posts that refer to "perception being reality" and the responsibility the software provider to "skew" our perceptions of their products I believe my post in response to yours is consistent. Your site positions Exponenet as an accounting solution and it came across to me that this was an "accounting" solution (not an accouting, CRM, ERP and e-commerce solution).
If there are CRM, SFA and e-commerce features in your software then I am interested to look further into what you have as we are in the market and seriously considering everyone. I have no issue with your post....my comments were around software features (IE comparing apples to apples with regards to features, in that Netsuite/Vision Core/Everest/Interprise, etc) are "all in one solutions" for a small business.
Regarding your latest post, I don't know that "open source" VS. "closed source" is an issue at all, especially since solutions likes Vision Core and Interprise now offer their source code.
Again, if your software has CRM, SFA and e-commerce functionality please
I am a very small business person. One woman show trying to get some drop ship business going in the gun industry. I am bound and determined to not spend a load of money doing this. I will be the first to say I am not familiar with all the different things that has been discussed on this thread.
I am using Zen Cart for my internet presence. http://www.zen-cart.com/ So far so good. I do have to pay a computer guy to do my set up for me with the credit card processing and the shipping rates. Well heck, he is just doing it all since I am not that talented. Just try to get a credit card company to approve you if you sell guns on the internet! Not a easy task even with a walk in store front. I did it though and am still plugging on the other details. This is what the program says it will do.
multiple customer modes,unlimited category depth, multiple sales and discounts,multiple display modes, XHTML template system, unlimited extra pages, multiple ad banner controller, multiple shipping options, multiple payment options, newsletter manager, discount coupons,gift certificates, featured products, quantity discounts
I am small so this will work for a while. There is also a easy populate module that is free but I had to get the paid version since I have over 14,000 product logged in to get the rest of the stuff on the net. Everything is switched off at this time until I have all the nit picking things worked out with shipping and someone trained to update inventory quantity and prices. My computer guy is slow but he is the only one I have found in several states that can do what I want him to much less at a cheap rate. Once I get this stuff put together I need to go in and smooth out some of the looks on the website but it will get there. Anyway.... Between Open Office and Zen cart and what other freebies I run across I might get this done. Hope this is information that will be useful to someone that needs to save some money.
Ranchmama
http://www.gunslingersgear.com
I don't know if econostores has all the features you need, but it is an all-in-one solution.
A note from MainStreet CEO Michael Sandler. At MainStreet, we are quite proud of our software package and our dedication to professional services and support. As posted above, we have a user that is upset. Despite the comments posted, we have reached out to this user and still sincerely welcome the opportunity to help this user within the constraints of the project resources and budget.
More broadly, we are always seeking to improve and our participation in this forum provides the opportunity to acknowledge issues (such as we did in a previous posting included below for reference), provide insight, and get feedback. As our user community benefits, so do we.
[Previous posting (for reference): There are absolutely legitimate concerns and a heavy dose of truth in the delays as professional services has been very busy. When someone wants MainStreet to do project work for the company, they have had to wait for a slotting which has been sometimes 4 or 5 weeks out. Acknowledging is hopefully a strong indication that there is a sincere desire to improve. During the past few months, the company has been working hard to correct and improve this and make more resources and documentation available. This has involved implementing a support portal, providing 2 hour "hot topic" conference call sessions, and beefing up support for third party developers who can do implementations of BusinessFlow.]
To give insight into the pricing change...we eliminated the up-front license fee for hosted deployments so that companies feel comfortable trialing BusinessFlow. It is $950/month subscription with no per user and no per module fees. Users may cancel their subscription if they wish. While this is a sign of our confidence in our software, it also acknowledges that because BusinessFlow is complex, it may require trial for a company to thoroughly evaluate how they will operate on the system and determine their use of the SDK to customize BusinessFlow for their company. Although BusinessFlow is standards based, there is most definitely a learning curve for a developer using the SDK and companies need to accurately scope their deployment. When a subscription starts, professional services are not included in the $950 as some companies do not require any assistance and therefore do not need to pay for assistance. So, we have not bundled it.
On deployments...we have been investing very heavily in the usability of the SDK to support third party developers. This is critical to our ability to scale and is consistent with the core values of the package - open and flexible. We are also working on our project management process whereby we require more definitive specifications if MainStreet engineers are to be used for a project. Because the software is flexible, in times past, we have used that flexibility to craft solutions for clients through our professionals services without having a detailed specification. While we would like to continue that creativity in our engineering, driving more clarity into solution specification will be good for the client and good for MainStreet to define success and reach it.
These changes and genuine efforts are part of our investment and commitment to the continued success of BusinessFlow and the BusinessFlow community.
Best Regards,
Michael Sandler
CEO
MainStreet Commerce
800-595-6246 Ext 85
[email protected]
Michael
I know the current strategy around MS is to not offer General Ledger because your findings lead you to believe most customers/companies have an existing GL software they prefer to "tie into" M.S., but I was wondering if you have re-thought about this.
Are there any plans to add built in General Ledger functionality into BusinessFlow? If you had it we would have probably chosen to go with you guys.
We just made the decision to go with Interprise Suite and will, over the next couple of months, be migrating our historical data and our 3 websites over to I.S.
Once we get this migration completed we will report back to let you know how it goes.
We really did try everything we could to stay with Netsuite, but it just didn't work out...
Hope this helps
Question from Mutahman posted above: I know the current strategy around MS is to not offer General Ledger because your findings lead you to believe most customers/companies have an existing GL software they prefer to "tie into" M.S., but I was wondering if you have re-thought about this. Are there any plans to add built in General Ledger functionality into BusinessFlow? If you had it we would have probably chosen to go with you guys.
Mutahman -
We are in discussions with companies like yours to get feedback and determine what will be the best way to proceed. The most likely outcome will be to provide specific feeds and/or connectors (tightly pre-configured) to packages such as Microsoft Dynamics and QuickBooks.
As you noted, in many deployments of BusinessFlow, it is serving an order entry/ order management hub in the enterprise with integrations through our synchronization layer into ERP packages, WMS packages, analytics packages, 3rd party logistics providers, etc. This deployment (best of breed) fits with BusinessFlow's architecture which focuses on being open and flexible.
That said, you and companies like yours have our attention, and I will keep you posted as we further our thinking. We welcome additional thoughts and advice.
Best Regards,
Michael Sandler
CEO
MainStreet Commerce
800-595-6246 Ext 85
[email protected]
www.mainstreetcommerce.com
Mutahman,
What made you decide to take the leap with Interprise? As you've said in previous posts, they have a very new product with a number of issues that need to be addressed. I've been evaluating Interprise and VisionCore recently and have been equally frustrated with trying to get solid references. They appear to have lots of functionality but not much of a track record.
Mr. Christmas, good question. I'm going to answer this honestly, and I'm sure that the reasons as to why we have made our decision will be debated as to "is that the correct reason to make such a decision".
We have the option to extend Netsuite for 3 years, and at a very aggressive price. I personally feel very strongly about the capabilities of the Netsuite product. On top of that, the fact that we have been using Netsuite for 3 years and all my people know the product and all our data is in "their" database would make it seem like a no brainer for me to stay with Netsuite (or at least extent the agreement for 3 years while I look for the best replacement AND let the market and it's players mature). Yet, based on the experience I have had with Netsuite over the past 3 months, I feel compelled to get away from them as quickly as possible. Here is what happened----I started to work with Netsuite (for our current renewal) in December '07, and what I have gone through to get this renewal completed has been absurd. I have it written in my original contract that there was a price cap on the increase at time of renewal...well I had to escalate this all the way up to their executive team to get this ok'd. Once I went through this exercise and got the "yes we will honor the contract", I was then given a new sales rep., who lasted 1 day. I was then handed over to another rep (who at the end of Dec. was at that time on the job for 7 months). We spoke at length a number of times, he provided me with a new quote and I noticed that a feature that was originally part of my base license, was now added in as a separate module that I was being charged extra for. I brought this to the reps attention, and he told me that he was going to CES but will bring this up to his management team and get it fixed. I waited a week (knowing he was on the road). I then sent him a few mails in mid Jan, then a couple of calls...finally by the end of January someone answered me and told me that my sales rep had left the company. OK....so then I am handed off to another guy, a good guy, been with the company for 7 years. OK great, so a guy who has been there a while, knows what he is doing...finally!! I explain to him the whole situation, in all its detail. He says, ok understand. He then gives me a quote. I look a it and say, OK. then I get a mail from the VP of sales, saying that quote is a mistake and he and I need to talk in a week when he gets back from being on the road
Now, all this time we are looking at different solutions. The 2 that we are leaning toward are Vision Core and Interprise. In my mind vision core is the leader cause I have played with their backend the most, and while it's a step or 2 down from Netsuite, what they are missing doesn't kill me and I could pay an integrator to build these customizations for me. The reason I have VC over Interprise is because my original demo with Interprise was a debacle. But then my web guy tells me there is a new version of Interprise (SP3). So we look at it and this version is greatly improved over what I saw last time. I then contact Vision Core to find out if we can see a demo of the shopping cart (able commerce) along with the backend. I'm told, wait a week they (able commerce) are just finishing up their demo. I wait a week, contact VC again and I'm told, "we're waiting for able and when they are reasy we will have a demo for you"....ok. Then 2 more weeks go by and I mail VC and say "do you want this business or not", I get a mail back "yes we want the business, please be patient they will have the demo soon". 2 days later I get a mail with demo links...I think, great. I try to load the demo, but it's not a demo....it's 2 live versions I need to load on servers. I call a local VC integrator, and he says "yup, these are actual copies that need to be installed on a server and then you have to do the integration between able and VC....because it's not yet done....this is a job that will take a number of hours to do". I contact VC and able, and they tell me--sorry the integration will not be ready until later this year. I'm thinking, ok they are out.
Now all this time we are looking at many other solutions, and none of them is really giving me enough of a reason to leave Netsuite, even though I now want to get away from them. Then I get a mail from Interprise saying they have a new hotfix for their latest release. I load the hotfix, I'm playing with the system for a few days, I go on their user forum (sign up) and then sent 11 PM's to 11 different customers who have posted on the forum. 10 of the 11 answered me and all 10 said they would definately choose Interprise again if they had to choose, all of them saying "yeah there are some small issues but these guys are very responsive". We asked for a quote, got a great deal and said, let's do this.
We have now found what seems to be a great person to extract all the data (including transactional data) from Netsuite at a very reasonable price, and have a local Interprise integrator who seems eager to get this rolled out. so I am hoping that over the next 3-4 weeks we get everything implemented, customized and 2 of our websites up and running, and that WE wind up being the benchmark reference account for Interprise.
Hope this helps
Mutahman, I appreciate all the info. I too have been back and forth with Interprise and VisionCore and have looked at many other ERP products on the market as well including the big boys. I have not seen any product that has the potential (at least for my situation) that Interprise has but I have pretty much decided that it's not ready for prime time. I have looked at several of their demo versions including the latest SP3 Hotfix 1. Each time I am impressed with the functionality but disappointed with the buggy nature of the software. Conceptually, I think Interprise has it right and wish you the best on your implementation. If you get it going, I don't think there is a better product.
On VisionCore, I also have the email with the "demos" and there appears to be an integration piece. I will post back to let you know if it's really there or not. That said, I do know that the integration piece is limited and is not as well integrated as aspdnsf and IP.
If anyone has any suggestions, I'm open. We're an INC 500 company and have several high volume websites that I would like to move to a new platform. So far we've looked at Netsuite, MS Dynamics, SAP Business One, Mainstreet, VisionCore, Interprise, Dydacomp, Everest and a few others.
How about:
www.sql-ledger.com
I've gotten to really like MySql, after finding out how our website's built-in SQL server works with Cart32 (www.novak-adapt.com). It works extremely well for us, and it is based off some custom code I contracted out for.
So, step-by-step we're phasing ourselves gladly out of the NetSuite yearly renewal nightmares.
Eric
MR.C.
We have run into a few bugs and I do see the issues being encountered by those posting on their user boards but we haven't run into anything yet that was of major concern. What have you found as the major bugs?
We also know we will need to do a bit of customization to make this exactly what we want (both on the IS side and the cart side). We're looking forward to this.
With regards to VC, what I was told was that the "integration" between the most recent version of Ablecommerce and VC is more like a bridge vs. a true integration and was quite a project to implement.
This will be an interesting transition and I will let you all know how it goes...and I'll try to be honest and be as impartial as I can with what I report back.
Hope this helps
Mutahman,
The major issue for me has to do with user roles and security (this may not be a problem for everyone but it's a major issue for me). I've asked about it and they said they were working on it but I don't expect it to be resolved in the short term. My other hang up was lack of documentation. Normally, I wouldn't be so picky but if I know I'm going to have some bumps in the road with a product, I would at least like good documentation/help to steer me along.
I'm not able to send a PM...maybe I don't have enough seniority out here. Anyway, send something my way and I'll be happy to chat.
On VC, I do still have some questions on what is one-way, two-way, etc. I know that I will have to do some work on the integration piece but VC will provide the source code which will give me something to start with.
Eric,Quote:
Originally Posted by Magneto
Thanks for the suggestion. I saw sql-ledger for the first time in this forum the other day and found it interesting. On the surface it looks like a fine product however I need something that will cover basic CRM (quoting, activity management, leads, opportunities), support a sales team (territory, sales commissions, etc), B2B and B2C pricing schemes in addition to the accounting and web. I've looked at trying to combine several products together to accomplish this but the all in one ERP's seem much more practical.
Mr. C
Mutahman,
I have been reading your posts with great interest. I think I am in the same boat as everyone else reading this thread, I'm looking for a solid one piece solution. I have also been looking at Interprise Suite but have not yet taken the plunge. I think I'm gun shy after my experience with Mainstreet. I would like to find out who you are working with for an integrator but I am unable to send you a personal message (PM). Looks like the PM works on the Interprise Suite forum, what is your username over there.
If you haven't checked out the IS forum yet it is definately worth reading through. It's refreshing to have this open to the public before buying the product. Another great forum is for Stone Edge Order Manager which has glowing reviews by their user base.
I have made several postings about Mainstreet Commerce over the past several weeks and I still stand by them. There seems to be no significant improvement in the company's customer support practices.
I would recommend a strict agreement in writing to secure an acceptable service level for customer support for anyone who is considering Mainstreet Commerce.
mutahman,
I tried to PM you but was unable to. I am also a Netsuite user looking at Interprise. You said "We have now found what seems to be a great person to extract all the data (including transactional data) from Netsuite at a very reasonable price, and have a local Interprise integrator who seems eager to get this rolled out."
Could you let me know how to contact this person as getting data out is a big pain. I was thinking about doing the Interprise install myself, but would be happy to talk to an integrator if they can make a good case for their services. And thanks for all you posts, they have been very helpful.
Guys
This week we are starting our implementation to Interprise Suite, and our integrator has a tool that will extract all the data (including transactional data) from Netsuite to I.S.
If you want to know his contact details please send me a PM
Thanks
Dom
For some reason I am not able to send you a PM, but I would love that contact. I am john (at) madebysurvivors.com
mutahman/Dom: The forum software is not allowing me to send PM. Do you have an email address to write to ?
We also compared ICode with NetSuite and ended up going with NetSuite. It's only been about two years and we have a significant amount of data stored in NetSuite. I've seen other postings on this thread about having so much data on-line in a hosted environment. We tried the .CSV data export from NetSuite however so much of the data "details" were missing we would be in big trouble if we actually lost our connection to NetSuite.
I ran across this company that provides a NetSuite to QuickBooks data conversion service and signed up for a one year "QuickBooks Backup File" service. Once a month they connect to our NetSuite database and download all the data and convert it into a standard QuickBooks file. At the end of the year we have all of our Customers, Vendors, Accounts, Inventory, Employees and all historical transactions "backed up" into QuickBooks. It's worked out great. Their contact link is http:\\www.SiliconDigitalSystems.com/DataConversion.
Also here's a link to another article about their NetSuite to QuickBooks services: http://talkback.zdnet.com/5208-10532...08160&start=-1
NetSuite to QuickBooks Data Conversion
We've been using NetSuite for about 3 years now with about 24,000 Inventory Items and Assembly's,
64,000 Customer Accounts and almost 450,000 Transaction records (Customer Invoices, Receive
Payments, Vendor Bill Payments, Checks, Journal Entries, Cash Receipts etc.)
Currently we're using the SDSI NetSuite to QuickBooks Backup Services to backup all our NetSuite
data to a QuickBooks file once a month. Can you contact the company and explore the option to have a
NetSuite to QuickBooks "Audit" Service added as well? The company's website is
http://www.SiliconDigitalSystems.com/DataConversion.
When our team has attended the NetSuite conferences many of the SDSI users request a similar Audit
tool so that we can find transactions that have been entered in NetSuite that match a certain criteria in
QuickBooks. The SDSI monthly data conversion is very accurate however we have so much data that
it's difficult to locate data using the NetSuite Search features. An Audit Service added to the SDSI
NetSuite to QuickBooks data conversion service would give us the ultimate functionality between
NetSuite and our QuickBooks backups.
Hope this helps!
I've received so many call's about the arcticle on ZDNet for the NetSuite to QuickBooks Backup Service from SDSI so here's the link info:
http://www.SiliconDigitalSystems.com/DataConversion.
Also here's a link to the original article: http://talkback.zdnet.com/5208-10532...08160&start=-1
This service backups all our NetSuite data including all historical transactions into a QuickBooks company file on a monthly basis. The NetSuite to QuickBooks data conversion is included in the service. Because of the many postings about problems with the NetSuite .CSV data export this option has worked well for us.
Tye
WOW, this is an educational thread. I've been in over my head researching accounting/ERP/ecommerce solutions for over a month now--and it is an exhausting process.
Mutahman, thank you for your helpful reviews. I hope I can be as helpful to others as you have been on this thread.
We are a small (under $3M) wholesale manufacturing and distributing company, currently operating on the dinosaur that is Quickbooks. It flat out stinks for inventory, and we need something more web-based now (multiple locations).
While that all-in-one suite seems like a dream come true, it just doesn't look like it's out there yet. I'm OK with piecing it all together, but ultimately, we need:
- GL, AR, AP, basic accounting (could leave on QB if we absolutely have to, ugh)
- Ecommerce for multiple sites
- CRM, but this doesn't have to be robust. We have a small sales staff.
- Commissions tracking and reporting
- Inventory/Warehouse Mgmt
- Shipping integration
- Customer Portal login
- Serialize/bin/bar coding system
Originally, we thought NetSuite was the best fix-all ever, but it sounds like there are still price-gouging issues, data-retrieval issues, and the fact that it's not open to google analytics is almost appalling!
Other things we've investigated:
Netbooks.com - looks very promising, however, we received and email saying that they were not currently accepting new customers due to the overwhelming response. A good problem to have, I suppose. They must be doing something right.
Pavintheway.com - a small company, but good alternative to NetSuite. Will now go investigate more.
Liferro.com - also not accepting new customers at this time.
Still have to go investigate some of the others mentioned here. I'll let everyone know if I learn anything promising or insightful.
We currently have a non-ecommerce site built on ModXCMS, which I'm excited about in and of itself. It interfaces with FoxyCart, so that only one login is required for content management and catalog management. Both are opensource, which is also encouraging. FoxyCart doesn't look like it currently interfaces with Quickbooks, however, so I'm not hopeful about integration with other programs just yet.
That not be very helpful just yet, but if anyone has any insight, I'm happy to continue to share what I learn along the way as well. Thanks to everyone who has shared here!